CA18DET bottom end query...

[CNHSS1]

good parts choice

the ET and DET cranks are different though. The 'nose' of the DET crank is bigger than the ET version so wont fit the oil pump.
The DET oil pump would have to be fitted along with the sump. Personally i think the DET sumps pants compared to the ET sump, it has loadsa louvres in the windage plate (to allow oil to drain back from head quicker i guess) but that does mean that on hard cornering/braking/acceleration the oil can move away from the pickup. Personally its why i think DETs have a reputation for 'chocolate' bigends, whereas the ET doesnt (and has same block and bearing design).The pickup is slightly different on the DET which means it has to come thru the plate at an angle, which means the plates not as tight a fit around the pickuup either.

also the bottom crank pulley for the timing belt wont fit, although if you ask 30PSI on here nicely, im sure he has a modified pulley for soem beer tokens

DET sump pan



ET sump pan



DET crank brace fouls ET sump, so ET sump needs a little 'percussive maintenance' with a ball pein hammer to clear the DET crank brace.

[Noodle_Soup]

Originally Posted by CNHSS1

good parts choice

the ET and DET cranks are different though. The 'nose' of the DET crank is bigger than the ET version so wont fit the oil pump.
The DET oil pump would have to be fitted along with the sump. Personally i think the DET sumps pants compared to the ET sump, it has loadsa louvres in the windage plate (to allow oil to drain back from head quicker i guess) but that does mean that on hard cornering/braking/acceleration the oil can move away from the pickup. Personally its why i think DETs have a reputation for 'chocolate' bigends, whereas the ET doesnt (and has same block and bearing design).The pickup is slightly different on the DET which means it has to come thru the plate at an angle, which means the plates not as tight a fit around the pickuup either.

also the bottom crank pulley for the timing belt wont fit, although if you ask 30PSI on here nicely, im sure he has a modified pulley for soem beer tokens



DET crank brace fouls ET sump, so ET sump needs a little 'percussive maintenance' with a ball pein hammer to clear the DET crank brace.

So if the nose is a big bigger, and i already have the crank and indeed the oil pump...(but as they say assumption is the mother of all fuck ups!) would it be possible to turn the nose down to suit the ET oil pump and indeed the crank gear?surely as you stated a little gentle persuasion with a cornish screwdriver the ET sump can be made to fit? as by your pics the windage plate looks weak in the DET!!was trying to retain as much of the ET engine as possible to keep the car loosely as intended. and the last thing i am wanting is to build this engine and have it fail due to DET death rattle!

ha, just when you think your getting near to completing your engine suddenly things start going backwards!!You wouldnt happen to have any DET squirters lying around would you? thinking thats the better way to go as i have had block bored to suit new pistons! and also dont wanna try and drill holes in new rods!

cheers for you help with this mate, saves me a lot of agro in the long run knowing all these things now!!

Ben

[CNHSS1]

i have to use ETs as the race regs dont allow changing the engine to a different type. Id say the ET sump is well up to the job. I can get 1.95G acceleration and not get surge
i have tried the DET oil pump into a bare ET block ages ago and it fits. You would then need to use the DET crank and oil pump (which you have), and either the DET sump (modify it to look like an ET one internally!) or modify an ET sump. I havent tried fitting a DET sump and oil pump into an ET, so its from memory/guess, but i reckon its the forward part around the oil pump thats different, so the ET one might not be easy to mod.
You will need to use the DET pickup with a DET pump too which is at a differnt angle (not central like the ET) so would foul the ET sump anyway.

Using the DETs crank brace is a good idea, certainly cheaper than the billet steel ones i had made (though not as nice) but you need to cut/grind away near the front and rear corners to clear the ET sump, and even then a little little 'persuasion' with a no.5. 'Fu** stick' is needed to the sump corners (not enough to distort it though.

Personally it may be easier to buy a spare ET crank, bound to be someone on here with one or else let me know and i'll ask a few mates if they have any, and flog your good DET crank (pretty rare these days!) and oil pump to someone with an S13. That should fund the new ET oil pump and then no need to machine a bottom timing belt pulley or mod the sump etc.
Still worthwhile using a modified crank brace from a DET though, and DET main bearing cap bolts (longer than ET but same thread etc).

I think that modding the DET crank is a no go, as the nose diameter is a few millimeters different, not a few thou, and also i think you would need a new drive flat for the oil pump grinding too as i think its asmaller diameter.
If you need to know for definite, let me know, i have scrap DET and ET cranks
and oil pumps i could measure. You probably have to get the cranks re-surface hardened too or nitrided as the grinding process would eat through the cranks standard surface hardness, not worth the hassle or expense if you can find a good spare ET crank and buy a new ET oil pump.
Dont drill holes in the DET rods, it'll wreck them.

Will make a nice motor that'll be nice and strong when its finished, without the crap DET sump issues

EDIT: Will have a look for oil squirters but pretty sure i havent mate. someone on here or sxoc should have some though

[Noodle_Soup]

Should have had a chat with you before getting stuff done mate, i knackered the crank so thinking a det crank would be easier to get hold of found one, and had it checked,ground and balanced and then bought bearings to suit!unfortuneatley the oil pump is for the ET so gotta real mis match going on! will stick a post on here and DW to see if i can get a decent ET crank, i imagine they are even rarer! i didnt wanna drill the rods but it was another idea thrown into the mix as a possible solution. will stick with the ET sump as i dont like the oil surge ideas and im pretty impressed with the 1.95 G acceleration! thats why i wanna stay 8v, prefer the torque curve! last time mine was on the rollers it was 183bhp and 195ftlbs torque (at 4,500rpm as i had a dodgy coil!) whats yours kicking out?

I do have a spare ET engine basically complete but didnt wanna rip it apart just to rob the crank, as it is still possible that i could encounter the same issues with a sticky crank gears!

[s13eater]

yeah, they produce some good torque, mine made 325ft/lbs .

[CNHSS1]

i will ask around our guys for a spare ET crank, sure someone will have one

S13 Eaters is the daddy on the figures, mines only 282hp/266lb/ft but thats only with a responsive Turbo Technics T28 hybrid @ 15psi. The ET is much underrated and overlooked by the DET. ive got some decent bits left if you fancy them? the turbo, Canadian fwd facing manifold and modified head and cam etc

a good DET crank with bearings would sell on sxoc a piece of pi55

[Noodle_Soup]

Originally Posted by CNHSS1

i will ask around our guys for a spare ET crank, sure someone will have one

S13 Eaters is the daddy on the figures, mines only 282hp/266lb/ft but thats only with a responsive Turbo Technics T28 hybrid @ 15psi. The ET is much underrated and overlooked by the DET. ive got some decent bits left if you fancy them? the turbo, Canadian fwd facing manifold and modified head and cam etc

a good DET crank with bearings would sell on sxoc a piece of pi55

if you could ask around for a crank that would be ace. Might be interested in the cam mate, how different is it to standard?im running a custom four branch top mount manifold and a IHI hybrid roller bearing TD05. and have an eight spark head which has been ported and polished.Bit concerned that i wont get the right monies for the crank and bearings, i mean the bearings were in the region of £150!!might get an ET crank ground to suit the bearings. Yours is still kicking out brave for the boost your running, im hoping to be running a bit more then 15psi, is that regs or reliability making you run that boost? seems i might have managed to find some squirters. the machining done on your blocks to take them was done on a milling machine im guessing, dont suppose you would have any specs, measurements for where they were drilled? i mean the pics help but bit hard to scale from there! are you running a modified cam in yours? just wondering if thats why your torque curve is less then the BHP at the top end.